Banjo Matthews: The Chassis Factory That Built 600+ NASCAR Cup Cars

Inside this building, every 1978 Grand National winner was welded together by the doing of this man, Banjo Matthews. But in the shop, the work schedule is quick and determined. Here, a small skilled squad of craftsmen bond a pile of steel tubing into the stiff and incredibly safe combination chassis and roll cage that forms the skeleton of Grand National stock cars. When was this building built? 69. I dug the footers for that building. Yeah, really? >> [laughter] >> Oh, that's cool. That makes sense. I mean, this from the awning that way. That That was the second building there, but me and my brother and another boy dug the footers for that building. Uh Banjo's brother-in-law moved up here. He came up here to be the foreman of this construction crew. And Banjo and his brother-in-law didn't get along. We sat on that bank, drank a six-pack after 5:00, got in the car and went home. He did that every day. Talking about drinking beer, Holsclaw, Linton, and Rutledge, all of them come sliding down the hill one day. They was pretty bad there. Like adult beverages. They slid in and they had seafood and out the door all the beer cans fell out of the dooley, you know. They just thing out of here. Holsclaw said, "Let's quit and go home, Banjo." He said, "It doesn't matter." So, we had to go up on the hill. >> [laughter] >> He bought 17 acres here. I'm not sure exactly sure when he bought it. It went all the way to Airport Road. And I think it stopped just a little old past that building there. It stopped. Then they started construction on this in early '69. He graded up there to build it. And they offered him more for that frontage than he had in all the property, so he just had to come down here and build it. Oh. >> did build up there. So, his property was the road frontage on Airport Road. >> frontage on Yeah, all this. And then he bought another 17 acres across the street where his house was. I've got some pictures to show the original road and all show you here. Interesting, cuz most people say this building doesn't exist anymore. I've heard that a thousand times, and you were the first person who told me, "No, it's still there. I know where it is." >> Come on. Come on, we'll go. Yeah, I want to see this place. Yeah, this used to be all gravel and dirt. Had two little slabs and it did it. The original building ended there with a three roof. Um all in all, all of it. The building was blue and Was it Yeah, it was blue, wasn't it? What years did you work here from? I worked from late '70 and quit in '81. Wow. And it's been changed around a lot. They moved the steps from that side to this side. Um before I forget it. Here's a zip drive with some pictures from here. Oh, okay. And I got some more pictures I got from Jody. You know, I think I've seen a couple pictures of inside this place, and now that I'm standing in here, I can kind of see that a little bit, like Wow, this is cool. Yeah, it used to be a metal rack there one time. And like I said, the steps were on the other side. That was a paint room. The sheet metal guy would try to stay ahead of these three surface plates. If Carey was working and they needed a rear firewall, he would try to have him a rear firewall before he needed it. And the same with me, and the same with the red metal surface plate. And the bar guy was bending bars, and he would try to keep him had a buggy, and he'd put my bars in front of the plate that I was going to use. And the same with the other two guys. >> didn't have to wait on any product. It was already >> went You didn't have to bend it yourself or make it yourself. Some The sheet metal guy or the bar guy would bend it made it. Would you have to then take it and then grind on it and fine-tune it to fit on what you were working on? But they did most of it. >> Oh, yeah. >> Like The majority You might have to tweak it a little bit, but the majority of it was already Yeah. notched, bent, angled cut, whatever you needed. Yeah. Um Okay. Interesting. So, you guys >> It's a lot different now where you buy this computer. I I I got Mike Bean's out there, and he's got one you stick a piece of pipe in it, tell it what you want, it runs out and turns it, rotates it, notches it, cuts it off. We didn't have all that. We had a We had a hydraulic bender. A hydraulic Greenlee bender, and we had a It was actually a a machine a press to push wrist pins in with that I think Leo or somebody made a die to notch bow bars with, just a fish mouth. Yeah. Bow worked by himself on the bars and Yeah, he bent about 90% of the bow bars. And there might be two people working in the sheet metal part. >> Yeah. We had Cuz it took I mean, to make a front firewall, it took two or three hours to get the holes in it, put the beads in it, and everything. Yeah, and then he bought a Pullmax, which made it a lot easier. You just clamped it up, and everything was perfectly straight. That's how you could always tell a Banjo car. His beads were probably 1/2 in wide. 7/8 7/8, and most of them were like 3/8 to 1/2. Hm. His beads would always be wider and not quite as pronounced as as a hand-rolled bead. And then we got a press brake and a hydraulic shear. That was big. Speed things up. And then we bought a forehead pattern torch. You drew it out with a special ink pen and put it under this eye, and it would trace it and cut it. Oh. Wasn't one of those things a laser cutter or a plasma cutter? It was map gas. Map gas, yeah. If you got an order for a surface plate car, how long would it take? Like maybe not normal, but if like I need this thing right now. 200 hours. Yeah. 200 hours elapsed or total man hours? Total man hours. How many real hours is that between all the men? We could probably build one in four days. Yeah. What >> [clears throat] >> But the calendar time, you know, from taking it from a rack to to plate to out the door was 200 hours. But man hours. Man hours. And then our complete car at that time was like 2,000 hours. >> Yeah. Paint and everything. Wow. We only did one or two of them. We didn't do one a year. >> The worst part was the windshields. I broke three sitting right over where that pile was at putting in Sam Summers' car. You used to had to use glass windshields in. And you take and grease it up and put silicone in it and lay it in there for about a week hoping it would dry. And sometimes it wouldn't, sometimes it would. Well, then you had to put all that molding around it. Well, if if it When you pull it out, sometimes the silicone won't be dry, so you had to go back and make it look nice. And if it had a high spot, the molding wouldn't go down, you'd beat on it, crack that windshield. We had an abundance of shitty windshields right here that were a little damaged, but part of the business. Did the red 27 car ever come out of here, or was that the I got some pictures of it. Really? So, >> to bring them out in a little bit. I'll be right back. I worked for Banjo from '68 to '71 when Ford quit. We got home from Daytona, and he said he didn't have a job. So, '71. I came back in '77 and worked here. It was different than we were building cars then until '81, '77 till '81. Have you been back in here since then? No. Really? No. Since '81? Uh oh, yes, I did. After I left here, I worked at a neighboring machine shop. And so, like every fall, Banjo built a car to take to Charlotte. So, Carey and the boys built the cars, and I came along, and I would help them finish it up, and uh I'd go to Charlotte and help them. I did We did that like two or three years. Banjo built a car for the fall Charlotte race. Bobby Isaac drove it one year. A.J. Foyt drove it one year. And it was kind of like a house car. The The promoter at Charlotte, Richard Howard. It was a house car, so they could spend 40 grand and put A.J. Foyt coming to the Charlotte race, and it would sell more tickets, you know. Oh. That kind of thing. This building has a lot It's awesome. I had no idea that car came out of this this building. It's still got the same blue paneling up in it. That's it. That That's looking back toward that door there. Wow, it looks almost exactly the same in here. Yeah. And this guy right here is That's him. I'm so glad you you found these little That's Harold Fagan. And we're staying up here, and there's Banjo's ramp truck. So, is that the same wood wall as the one in here? >> before they built the steps upstairs. Okay. It had swinging doors going into the park room. So, is that that door Is that door there And you can kind of see where the circle was, where that clock Right. used to be Yeah. above the door. Yeah. But this was when the building was brand new. That is so cool. That 429, that was a monster. Who had these pictures? Huh? Who had these pictures? Uh Banjo's son. That is incredible. >> to get him to come today, but he's out of town. But Stacy can tell you that was the first 429 that Banjo ever built. And it was right here at this door standing there where that picture was made. That door frame it was right there. This was Banjo's office? Yeah. And this is the office that cut off. He's now sitting back here, and this was the competition There was a lot of things went on in NASCAR as far as rule making and the French family and Gasaways were all made in this office right here. We had rules and regulations. Yeah, when this door shut and company was here it was serious. How did you do that? You didn't turn a breaker on or anything? No. Yeah, I didn't touch it, but that's where you turn it on and off. So, I guess Banjo wanted you to have light. Yeah, but they used to have a little wire Banjo cuz that sticker there and I asked but I didn't know if Banjo would let us do this. But it had a Banjo right there. It was one of the nail holes. You see that? >> But you could see if and there was a nail. Oh, there's the outline of it. You can see it. Yeah, I can see it now. Yeah, see the Banjo going up through there? You can see it. >> Banjo right there. You can even see the where the the strings are. Like for all the grinding dust maybe it kind of imprinted on there. It was like a little wire Banjo but it was nailed up here and there and like I say if you look you can see the shape of it right there. Originally the building ended right here. Um and the receptionist was here. There was a picture on this wall on this wall of Banjo and Donnie looking at a 429 on his little wagon. I've got it and then there was one on this picture on this wall of A.J. and the Wood Brothers 21 car. And I've got it. And I named my son after A.J. Cuz I told my wife when we got when she got pregnant I said, "If we have a son his name's going to be A.J. If we have a girl you can name her whatever you want but son is going to be A.J." I had visions of him racing but so glad he didn't. So, if somebody would walk in and there was that mat that said Banjo is where money buys speed. Was that >> Well, that was That was out that door. That was over here originally. Later this came along with the IROC part. See, this this was the end of that building. And um if there was ever a hurricane stand behind that wall cuz it won't blow down. There's probably enough steel there to build three race cars. And the guy laid a whole wall one day while Banjo was on the phone. And he come out and one of the mortar joints went straight and it tore the whole wall down. And laid three eighth bolts between each one of those bricks. But I've got [clears throat] pictures of this when it was a parts counter. And Stacy and I and the other guys were in the photo here but uh it used to be a parts counter there. With when he really got big in the parts. And this was Bill Seifert's office to start with. So, you said this was built when he started doing the IROC chassis? >> cuz we didn't have enough room to Would that have been like '76, '70 I forget when they >> '77. '6 or '7, yeah. I came here uh the Monday after Thanksgiving '77 is when I came back here. And they started doing IROC stuff in here? >> already shipped three of them. Okay. There were three of them I believe and they had some still on the floor. So, for people who don't know pretty much every Winston Cup team in the '80s had a Banjo Matthews chassis. The only one that didn't buy one that I know of directly from here was Petty's but they bought one that we built for Cale Yarborough. Really? >> So, in '78 or '9 every car started the Daytona 500 with a Banjo car. If I I'm not sure exactly sure the dates but Don't tell people that today when they get mad about every car coming from the same place. It happened before. It happened and there was different car builders. So, yeah it it it has happened but um A little more creativity a lot back then. >> This was before the fine barber chair set. And there was a phone booth over at one time and Banjo like he got locked up over it. Um What do you mean? Dicky Flanders was a friend of his. Like Dicky bought the Glen Rocker. There was an old hotel that had a an old wooden phone booth in it. Dicky brought that in and gave it to Banjo and we were all sitting right here one day and guy comes in to see time. He wants to know where Mr. Matthews is at and they told him and uh he whipped out his federal badge. >> [laughter] >> Said I'm here to get that phone booth. Banjo said, "You can't get my phone booth." Well, come to find out it's a federal offense to have a phone booth with the money changer still in it. The booth wasn't the problem. It was the chuck money changer that was the problem. So, he said, "Well, I'm either leaving here with the changer or you. Which way you want to go?" And Paul was the guy that had the bushy hair that worked here. Told him to go get the key to unlock that phone booth and get him whatever he needed. >> [laughter] >> He won't go to jail but Jody still has >> Why he [clears throat] want the changer? I wonder what Well, it just when Dicky when they tore the hotel down Dicky just got everything out of it and Yeah. It probably after dark, too. Well, at one time Jody still had that phone booth. Yeah, this was the original parts counter. There's a picture on that zebra mat that I bought so standing at that door with that Banjo mat there. It originally laid here in front of the parts counter. Is that the mat that Ronnie Thomas has now? Yeah, Jason Thompson in Tennessee that bought the two Talladegas. He had it originally. He bought it all that from Jody. Uh Um Then he sold it all off. He sold um They sold a red Talladega uh to Barry Jackson and the white one Ray Everham bought. I think Ray told me somebody in New Jersey or somewhere else bought the white one. So, was this what was going on in here? >> This was the parts room. So, this would have been like in the '80s whenever all the cup teams were getting using Banjo chassis? >> Yeah, the the wall in the parts room went from all of that was like shipping and receiving. Those those those restrooms weren't there. They divided this off here a few years ago. This was the a place that worked on cars and that was a uniform company. This was the back of the original building and that was the paint booth. This was the engine shop. The engine shop for the 27 car? Well, no the the one in the middle was originally the second bay over. The first bay was the paint booth. >> Okay. The second bay was originally machine shop cuz he used to stock engines. And then this became the engine room. And then he built engines for customers. Yeah, for customers. >> They never uh I don't know that they ever build an engine for a 27 cup car here. So, he did engines here even Didn't uh we get them from Junior? No, they came from Chevrolet. I remember signing the ticket on it from Anton Chevrolet. It was $987 for a 427 Chevrolet. I brought it back here and took it apart, balanced it, changed the cam, put an oil pan on it and we went Charlotte leading the race and I told him open and then we went to Rockingham and finished fourth. And Cale Yarborough bought that car. And then we built the Malibu or Lumina. Oh, for Isaac? For Isaac. Went to Daytona on the 125 and did but So, was that the occasional house car you're talking about? >> Yeah, it would be tied in to Junior but um I'm trying to get get my bearings as far as stuff. Richard Howard was pro- promoter at Charlotte. And so, he owned Junior's first Chevrolets. He was he was uh funding it cuz Junior's car sometimes said Howard Furniture on the quarter panel of it and that's Richard Howard. He had a professional men's softball team, too, that played uh around in the middle of the states. Probably one of the few things that's still here. So, much like all of you I have also been impacted by the crazy rise in gas prices over the last few months, especially diesel because I drive a diesel truck. So, I'm always looking for any way I can to save a dollar here and there because when you drive a lot that stuff compounds. Well, today's video sponsor is Upside. It gives you cash back on gas, groceries, and dining. Here's how it works. You open the app, you claim an offer, and you pay like normal. That's it. Over 100,000 participating locations. 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Yeah, it looks like it's big enough to power a ship. I don't see a [snorts] lot on this side. So, this is this is the only surviving non-touched That that >> thing in closet in 33 10 69. So, I wonder if that was uh October of 1969 this >> Probably compressor was made. Yeah, it was I come here like you say in the fall of '70 and it was here then. So So was it in this original spot No, it was that's It's been there since 1970. I thought you said this area here was added on to in the mid-70s for IROC. Yeah, but he had the air compressor separate of the building. Oh, so it was And and I think he just had didn't he have like a cover built over it? And then when he when he Wouldn't it have been on the outside of the building? >> Yeah. Where it wouldn't be so noisy. >> this building wasn't here and and they may have moved it from there to here when they put that dish. I don't remember that. But that's the same air compressor. It may not have been in this exact location, but it was here. Wow. It may have been >> It was outside to begin with. Yeah, it which it was Yeah, this would have been it's still outside. Yeah. But it was uh Was it behind the diner room over here with the Yeah, it would have been behind the paint room, I'm pretty sure. All these All these steel beams are painted white? >> Yeah. They had to be painted before they put them up. Yeah. Banjo he didn't want >> pictures of of them being painted. He didn't want that red primer. Is that one of the ones on the other side were painted white to match these ones? Cuz in those pictures they're red. The old guy that done that was Sam Kent. He was probably 80…